Connecticut Murders

[85vette]

Rich, not sure if this goes here, feel free to move it if need be....


What are your thoughts on stopping these senseless murders? Gun control laws won't work because there are miliions of guns already out there and the bad guys aren't gonna give theirs up. And I'm sure not given' up mine.

I was a School Resource Officer for four years of my career as a Sheriff's Deputy. We were trained in Active Shooter Response, just for such a situation as what happened today. And I don't mean we took a class on it, we lived it, every year during the summers. We had unknown scenarios at different schools and were sent in with "Simunition", which are Glocks(like the ones we carried) that shoot wax bullets. (And, yes, they hurt!) We trained and were critiqued by some of the best in the world. (Dano Miller of Semper Fi International, for one.) We were trained to go to the threat and stop the shooter. Some of those officers got "killed" during the training. Myself and another deputy (a SWAT team member) were the only ones who survived throughout all the training.(during all four years) I did get shot in my left hand once, but I still was able to find the shooter and "kill" him. I told my superiors that I needed a gun locker in the school I was assigned to so my M16 would be handy in the event a situation occurred, but I was told that would never happen, so I kept it in the trunk of my cruiser. Sadly, a Glock is no match for an M16 or AK47, but we were prepared to make do with what we had.

I think we need SRO's in every school in America, not just high schools and middle schools. Knowing there are well trained officers in every school would be a deterent I believe, but more importantly, someone would be there to respond immediately, and neutralize the threat, if the need did arise.

 

[Rich Z]

Heck, I think a big step forward would be to have any of the faculty interested in helping out and willing to undergo some training to be able to carry a gun, or at least have one close at hand. You would think by now that most people would have noticed that "gun-free" zones are just a safe haven for nut jobs to bring their own weapons to with little fear of finding any effective resistance against them. It's basically made assaults against all those victims very little more challenging than shooting fish in a barrel. You might as well draw circles around pertinent areas and put signs up stating: "Shoot here. No one will shoot back."

As it is now, even if someone did have a gun handy, they would hesitate simply because they would know that regardless of their saving lives, they would at the very least lose their job for their efforts. Maybe even be prosecuted for violating the law themselves.

Why our government wants to make "criminal friendly" zones is completely beyond my comprehension.

 

[Mark Dalton]

As it is now, even if someone did have a gun handy, they would hesitate simply because they would know that regardless of their saving lives, they would at the very least lose their job for their efforts. Maybe even be prosecuted for violating the law themselves.

That's a fact, as evidenced by AutoZones reaction in a similar situation.:nonod:

 

[Rich Z]

That's a fact, as evidenced by AutoZones reaction in a similar situation.:nonod:

Yeah, what a dilemma these sorts of rules and regulations put people. A smart crook would hang out only in places where it is against the law for people to have guns. You approach your victim, and if they do pull a gun in defense, you give them this choice: "Your wallet and valuables with no fuss, or even though you DO have a gun, you go to jail along with me. Trust me, what it's going to cost you for a defense attorney is going to be MANY MANY times the value of what you have on your person right now. And then when you become a felon, they will take that gun away from you anyway, and you can NEVER own another. So just hand over your gun and everything else nice and easy and you can go home to your family tonight."

Easy pickins...........

So do you think employees at Autozone will come to your aid again if there is another armed robbery in the store they work in where YOU happen to be? Yeah, right......

 

[Cor66Vette]

... A smart crook would hang out only in places where it is against the law for people to have guns. ... Easy pickins...........

I remember reading somewhere, (an anecdote no doubt) where two neighbors had discourse with each other over their opposing views on guns in the home. The anti-gun neighbor felt that the presence of a gun in the home would do more harm than good- "people could get killed", or something like that he thought. The pro gun neighbor felt that by having his firearm(s) at the ready, he reduced the odds against him in the event an altercation with a perp occurred. Anyway, as the story concludes, the pro gun neighbor offered to place a sign on his lawn, warning criminals that this home owner is a gun owner, and guns kill people, people don't kill people and that they should go next door because there are no guns there and they will be safer.

 

[85vette]

http://media.beta.photobucket.com/image/unarmed neighbor/LavaTech/Various/4936.jpg

 

[Rich Z]

I remember reading somewhere, (an anecdote no doubt) where two neighbors had discourse with each other over their opposing views on guns in the home. The anti-gun neighbor felt that the presence of a gun in the home would do more harm than good- "people could get killed", or something like that he thought. The pro gun neighbor felt that by having his firearm(s) at the ready, he reduced the odds against him in the event an altercation with a perp occurred. Anyway, as the story concludes, the pro gun neighbor offered to place a sign on his lawn, warning criminals that this home owner is a gun owner, and guns kill people, people don't kill people and that they should go next door because there are no guns there and they will be safer.

Yeah, ask an antigunner to wear an armband disclosing the fact that they positively are unarmed. If they really feel so strongly about the issue, make a PUBLIC statement about it to show your support. Most don't even realize that others being armed around them, and the perps no knowing exactly who is armed and who is not, is working FOR them to protect them.

 

[vett boy]

20 kids we're stabbed in China recently .Not only should guns be band bread knifes should be on the list along with nail clippers (that's a joke).

Ya know if I had a fist full of money I could go to the Ukraine buy a nuke from some corrupt army general .Place the nuke in a cargo container and ship it up the Hudson river for detonation .What keeps people from doing it ,morals .I personnely have no desire to commit mass murder of innocent people.

My heart aches for all the parents and love ones of those Kids and adults that we're killed but in reality I'm afraid it may only be a beginning of a trend.Super sad.

 

[Rich Z]

There are some rumors floating around that anti-depressant drugs may be at least partially behind this madness. So many people are medicated these days, that you have to wonder if we are beginning to see some side effects that the drug companies would rather not publicize.



Now if you want to read about a particularly scary drug, and think about the implications of it being widely used, well, try this one on for size ->

http://digitaljournal.com/article/324779

 

[vett boy]

I'm no religious zealot but there has never been a violent act committed at a traditional Christian school .There was not one mass murder in the US school system from 1927-1964 why is that ?:shrug01:

 

[Rich Z]

I'm no religious zealot but there has never been a violent act committed at a traditional Christian school .There was not one mass murder in the US school system from 1927-1964 why is that ?:shrug01:

Yeah, especially since up to 1934 full automatic weapons were available to EVERYONE. And up to 1968 a person could buy a Lahti 20mm anti-tank cannon off of the back page of Popular Science and buy a gun nearly everywhere, even via mail order) simply by plunking down their money.

Logic would tell someone that facts are pointing to either one of two things: (1) Either more gun laws and restrictions cause more gun related crime, or (2) whatever factors that are increasing gun crime have absolutely nothing to do with the gun laws being imposed.

So what does this all have to say about the effectiveness of gun laws? :shrug01:

 

[85vette]

Isn't 1964 about the time the ACLU outlawed prayer in schools?

 

[vett boy]

Isn't 1964 about the time the ACLU outlawed prayer in schools?

Bingo.

No school prayer
Limited pledge of allegiance
Single parents
Teachers expected to raise the kids
No discipline in or out of school
Parents on drugs
care to add to the list -----------------

Religion is the catalyst to morals .Can an atheist have morals ? certainly but organized religion that doesn't go over the top generally makes better people.
:yesnod: This comes from yours truly who attends church at least twice a year.

 

[mickeystoysz16]

Yeah, what a dilemma these sorts of rules and regulations put people.

you go to jail along with me. Trust me, what it's going to cost you for a defense attorney is going to be MANY MANY times the value of what you have on your person right now. And then when you become a felon, they will take that gun away from you anyway, and you can NEVER own another.

This is more true than you know. I know someone that was carjacked. When they pulled a .45 the police arrested the victim for using a weapon. Castle Doctrine was the only reason that person did not do any time, but STILL has a felony record for publicly discharging a firearm and cost about $15k for a defense attorney.

 

[Rich Z]

I guess it's pretty obvious that the Castle Doctrine law is null and void in designated gun free zones.

You do have to wonder why "criminal free" zones aren't being designated anywhere, though......... :shrug01: